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	<title>Comments on: should the Sierra Club support freight railroads?</title>
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		<title>By: patrick</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-9427</link>
		<dc:creator>patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 00:07:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-9427</guid>
		<description>Hi Tom,

Unfortunately benign neglect will not be adequate. In the October 2007, issue of &lt;a href=&quot;http://Railwayage.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Railway Age&lt;/a&gt;, the railroads report needing $148 billion dollars over the next 28 years just to meet the needs for freight. $135 billion is just for the 7 Class I roads. 

This money just represents investment needed to continue to handle the same percentage of traffic that they do today.

&quot;The study assumes little if any modal shift of freight transport&quot; - David J Hunt lead partner of Cambridge Systematics. Cambridge Systematics did the study for the American Association of Railroads.

Hunt says that the railroads can fund $96 billion themselves ($3.4 billion/year) leaving a shortfall of $39 billion (1.4 billion/year).

The study assumes no growth in passenger travel., nor does it anticipate an increase in freight market share.

However, the study also does not anticipate the (possible) decline in coal traffic. In the same issue, coal for the week ending 15 September was 142,925 carloads out of 338,147 ( 42% ). The report does not report the actual miles traveled so it is difficult to judge actual impact on capacity. However, considering that coal travels in unit trains (which means it does not have to be switched in a yard along the way) I would think that the impact would be relatively lower than 42%.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Tom,</p>
<p>Unfortunately benign neglect will not be adequate. In the October 2007, issue of <a href="http://Railwayage.com" rel="nofollow">Railway Age</a>, the railroads report needing $148 billion dollars over the next 28 years just to meet the needs for freight. $135 billion is just for the 7 Class I roads. </p>
<p>This money just represents investment needed to continue to handle the same percentage of traffic that they do today.</p>
<p>&#8220;The study assumes little if any modal shift of freight transport&#8221; &#8211; David J Hunt lead partner of Cambridge Systematics. Cambridge Systematics did the study for the American Association of Railroads.</p>
<p>Hunt says that the railroads can fund $96 billion themselves ($3.4 billion/year) leaving a shortfall of $39 billion (1.4 billion/year).</p>
<p>The study assumes no growth in passenger travel., nor does it anticipate an increase in freight market share.</p>
<p>However, the study also does not anticipate the (possible) decline in coal traffic. In the same issue, coal for the week ending 15 September was 142,925 carloads out of 338,147 ( 42% ). The report does not report the actual miles traveled so it is difficult to judge actual impact on capacity. However, considering that coal travels in unit trains (which means it does not have to be switched in a yard along the way) I would think that the impact would be relatively lower than 42%.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-9389</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 07:35:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-9389</guid>
		<description>Any realistic look at the numbers suggest that freight rail is inherently pro environment.  It is 3 to 4 times as fuel efficient as trucking.  Rail has a much smaller footprint then interstate highways.
Right now, we are under invested as a nation in rail, and all that really needs to be done is to leave them alone.  Basically, they are making profits and are ready and able to reinvest in the necessary infrastructure to increase rail vs trucking.
Rail is currently using hybrids (see the GE Evo Locomotive), and is making major technological strides to become more efficient.
There are a number of legacy issues regarding railroads which miss the major point.  Basically, all they need is to be left alone and current trends will favor growth in rail.
A lot of people, myself included, would like to see more passenger rail.  However, that needs to be treated as a separate issue and the more pressing issue of moving from long haul trucking to intermodal needs to happen.
If anything needs to be subsidized, its the promotion of low emission coal power plants.  
I&#039;m not sure that anything needs to be done except to keep from allowing special interests from preventing the growth of what is a huge plus for the environment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any realistic look at the numbers suggest that freight rail is inherently pro environment.  It is 3 to 4 times as fuel efficient as trucking.  Rail has a much smaller footprint then interstate highways.<br />
Right now, we are under invested as a nation in rail, and all that really needs to be done is to leave them alone.  Basically, they are making profits and are ready and able to reinvest in the necessary infrastructure to increase rail vs trucking.<br />
Rail is currently using hybrids (see the GE Evo Locomotive), and is making major technological strides to become more efficient.<br />
There are a number of legacy issues regarding railroads which miss the major point.  Basically, all they need is to be left alone and current trends will favor growth in rail.<br />
A lot of people, myself included, would like to see more passenger rail.  However, that needs to be treated as a separate issue and the more pressing issue of moving from long haul trucking to intermodal needs to happen.<br />
If anything needs to be subsidized, its the promotion of low emission coal power plants.<br />
I&#8217;m not sure that anything needs to be done except to keep from allowing special interests from preventing the growth of what is a huge plus for the environment.</p>
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		<title>By: patrick</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-148</link>
		<dc:creator>patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Oct 2006 02:43:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-148</guid>
		<description>Norfolk Southern is independent of CSX. Both CSX and NS split up Conrail a few years ago.

BNSF and NS both have fairly good ability to keep Amtrak trains on-time ... because they want to. UP and CSX doesn&#039;t.

FYI John Snowe, currently in Bush the Lesser&#039;s administration, used to run CSX.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Norfolk Southern is independent of CSX. Both CSX and NS split up Conrail a few years ago.</p>
<p>BNSF and NS both have fairly good ability to keep Amtrak trains on-time &#8230; because they want to. UP and CSX doesn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>FYI John Snowe, currently in Bush the Lesser&#8217;s administration, used to run CSX.</p>
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		<title>By: Nick</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-146</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Oct 2006 06:08:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-146</guid>
		<description>I hear rumors that Cheney is a big investor in UP and UP has donated many $$$ to the 00&#039; and 04&#039; Bush/Cheney Campaigns.  I&#039;ve also heard that UP has big ties to Haliburton (Oil Shipping most likely).

UP and CSX are particularly finiky with rail passenger service for 2 reasons:

1) UP and CSX are enroaching.  UP owns almost all rails in the western US, while BNSF owns only a few mainlines.  CSX owns Norfolk Southern aka NS (I think) and has absorbed both Conrail and Seaboard System, all of which covers the eastern US.  Which leaves Canadian National, Canadian Pacific, a handfull of branch line operators, and commuter rail.

2)  All that recent job outsorcing has lead to a rise in imports, which has lead to a rise in freight-rail traffic.  Soaring Gas prices have also made more companies ship by rail to kill two birds with one stone.

The result: freight congestion! Often, a passenger train on a host railroad will be stuck on a single track block with 2 approaching freight trains in both directions.

More rail infrastructure is needed.  But there should also be more cooperation between freight and passenger rail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hear rumors that Cheney is a big investor in UP and UP has donated many $$$ to the 00&#8242; and 04&#8242; Bush/Cheney Campaigns.  I&#8217;ve also heard that UP has big ties to Haliburton (Oil Shipping most likely).</p>
<p>UP and CSX are particularly finiky with rail passenger service for 2 reasons:</p>
<p>1) UP and CSX are enroaching.  UP owns almost all rails in the western US, while BNSF owns only a few mainlines.  CSX owns Norfolk Southern aka NS (I think) and has absorbed both Conrail and Seaboard System, all of which covers the eastern US.  Which leaves Canadian National, Canadian Pacific, a handfull of branch line operators, and commuter rail.</p>
<p>2)  All that recent job outsorcing has lead to a rise in imports, which has lead to a rise in freight-rail traffic.  Soaring Gas prices have also made more companies ship by rail to kill two birds with one stone.</p>
<p>The result: freight congestion! Often, a passenger train on a host railroad will be stuck on a single track block with 2 approaching freight trains in both directions.</p>
<p>More rail infrastructure is needed.  But there should also be more cooperation between freight and passenger rail.</p>
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		<title>By: Just wondering&#8230;. &#187; Blog Archive &#187; September Coast Daylight report</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-130</link>
		<dc:creator>Just wondering&#8230;. &#187; Blog Archive &#187; September Coast Daylight report</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Sep 2006 23:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-130</guid>
		<description>[...] Hutchison (Amtrak) reported that &#8220;The Starlight&#8221; has been badly bruised by the On-time Performance (OTP) [see this post for more information] with ridership and revenue plummeting and in name (e.g &#8220;Starlate&#8221;). Amtrak and UP are now in &#8220;High Level&#8221; meetings addressing the OTP. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Hutchison (Amtrak) reported that &#8220;The Starlight&#8221; has been badly bruised by the On-time Performance (OTP) [see this post for more information] with ridership and revenue plummeting and in name (e.g &#8220;Starlate&#8221;). Amtrak and UP are now in &#8220;High Level&#8221; meetings addressing the OTP. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: MettaTrained</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-118</link>
		<dc:creator>MettaTrained</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Sep 2006 15:16:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-118</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s more sinister than that.  The Bush admin hates Amtrak, and they figure one way to kill it is to let UP have it&#039;s way, putting its freight trains ahead of Amtrak passenger trains, causing delays so that Amtrak is always late, and then the public will stop riding.  The bush appointees in whatever dept. oversees Amtrak don&#039;t have their fingerprints aren&#039;t on the corpse.  I&#039;d be willing to bet that it&#039;s the same kind of laissez faire attitude that led to the Katrina disaster.  Their idea is that government isn&#039;t supposed to work, so they don&#039;t let it work.  If the govt. wanted Amtrak on time, they would get UP to give passenger trains priority. They wouldn&#039;t sit back and do nothing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s more sinister than that.  The Bush admin hates Amtrak, and they figure one way to kill it is to let UP have it&#8217;s way, putting its freight trains ahead of Amtrak passenger trains, causing delays so that Amtrak is always late, and then the public will stop riding.  The bush appointees in whatever dept. oversees Amtrak don&#8217;t have their fingerprints aren&#8217;t on the corpse.  I&#8217;d be willing to bet that it&#8217;s the same kind of laissez faire attitude that led to the Katrina disaster.  Their idea is that government isn&#8217;t supposed to work, so they don&#8217;t let it work.  If the govt. wanted Amtrak on time, they would get UP to give passenger trains priority. They wouldn&#8217;t sit back and do nothing.</p>
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		<title>By: Andy Chow</title>
		<link>http://sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/comment-page-1/#comment-104</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Chow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Sep 2006 03:21:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sworddance.com/blog/2006/08/22/should-the-sierra-club-support-freight-railroads/#comment-104</guid>
		<description>What UP and other freight operators don&#039;t realize is that it is bad business for them to treat passenger rail so poorly.

UP, BNSF, and CSX are not consumer brands, therefore the general public have little concern about what they do, have very little understanding in regards to the benefits freight rail brings, and consequently less willing to provide government funding.

Passenger rail like Amtrak is a consumer brand and consumers have direct relationships with passenger rail operators. Voters are willing to spend tax dollars into passenger rail.

To prove the point about familiarity, most people can name passenger airlines but not cargo-only airlines.

If UP and freight rail operators are preceived as non-cooperative in getting more passenger rail, more money will go to light rail, BRT, and highways, which the freight railroads get absolutely zero benefit. If freight railroads are cooperative, they will be able to negotiate an arrangment where public monies can help to improve both passenger and freight trains.

On the other hand, trucking companies have no problem in getting more highway funding because they can argue, and that politicians understand, that highway expansions also help solo auto commuters who vote.

It is not that hard to get tax monies to help freight rail. It doesn&#039;t make political sense for freight railroads to ask for public subsidy and refuse to fulfill public&#039;s demand for more passenger rail at the same time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What UP and other freight operators don&#8217;t realize is that it is bad business for them to treat passenger rail so poorly.</p>
<p>UP, BNSF, and CSX are not consumer brands, therefore the general public have little concern about what they do, have very little understanding in regards to the benefits freight rail brings, and consequently less willing to provide government funding.</p>
<p>Passenger rail like Amtrak is a consumer brand and consumers have direct relationships with passenger rail operators. Voters are willing to spend tax dollars into passenger rail.</p>
<p>To prove the point about familiarity, most people can name passenger airlines but not cargo-only airlines.</p>
<p>If UP and freight rail operators are preceived as non-cooperative in getting more passenger rail, more money will go to light rail, BRT, and highways, which the freight railroads get absolutely zero benefit. If freight railroads are cooperative, they will be able to negotiate an arrangment where public monies can help to improve both passenger and freight trains.</p>
<p>On the other hand, trucking companies have no problem in getting more highway funding because they can argue, and that politicians understand, that highway expansions also help solo auto commuters who vote.</p>
<p>It is not that hard to get tax monies to help freight rail. It doesn&#8217;t make political sense for freight railroads to ask for public subsidy and refuse to fulfill public&#8217;s demand for more passenger rail at the same time.</p>
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